80GB PS3 has limited backwards compatibility
by Alexander Sliwinski 
{ Jul 9th 2007 at 4:15PM }
The box states: "This product has limited backwards compatibility with PlayStation and PlayStation 2 format software ... visit www.us.playstation.com for system software update." We're attempting to find out if the new 60GB versions rolling off the assembly line will also switch over to the BC software. So, if you're really into your old PS and PS2 games, might want to check and see if they are compatible with the software or get a system currently available before the switch.
*Update: From Dave Karraker, Sr. Director, Corporate Communications regarding the red light: "It is just a lighting trick. Nothing different or new about it."
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Ant @ Jul 9th 2007 4:19PM
man ppl are observent!
i dont doubt that emulation is coming to the states thats how they "reduced" the price on 60gb console.
wei @ Jul 9th 2007 4:19PM
not a surprise, at all but.. good job sony, way to charge $100 for 20 gb of HD, a game not everyone wants, and stripped down hardware.
i just hope they initiate some sort of trade-in program for when they roll out the rumble controllers..
Konny @ Jul 9th 2007 4:22PM
This is basically the same version as the Korean, 80gb PS3.. so no big surprise.. they are looking to cut costs. Get your 60 gb PS3 while you can.
Adv2k1 @ Jul 9th 2007 4:23PM
good news and soon after retarded news that sort reverses the good news. Is this Sony's plan because it seems like they love doing it. Sheesh they should either make it play all previous games or not, why bother with 90% works and %10 doesn't crap.
Digi Smalls @ Jul 9th 2007 4:25PM
this won't just be true for the 80gig model. expect it in the 60gig version soon as well.
i expect many brandboys' arguments about the relevance of backward compatibility to change accordingly.
.
DBX00 @ Jul 9th 2007 4:26PM
If you don't want the 20GB or game just opt for the $499 60GB. Also, people made such a big deal about the European version having software emulation, but guess what...after it was released and they continually updated the firmware it turned out not to be a big deal. In fact, the majority of the games that are being upscaled now on your PS3 are probably using that software emulation already. Just because the emotion engine is in the system doesn't mean that it is being utilized or will be utilized once they optimize the software emulation. This isn't a big deal b/c they have all the big titles covered and you have the option to purchase the 60GB console for a $100 cheaper and upgrade the hard drive to 120GB + with the savings. The price cut is a great move and since the hard drive is easily upgradable it doesn't make sense to purchase the most expensive version if you use some common sense.
Evan @ Jul 9th 2007 6:22PM
@DBX00 "This isn't a big deal b/c they have all the big titles covered"
I don't care about the big titles, I've already played those. It's the obscure gems that fell through the cracks that keep me playing PS1 games even now! Exactly the type of games that are ignored by Sony and Microsoft on compatibility efforts.
DckPump @ Jul 9th 2007 4:26PM
Um... What are people complaining about?
sheppy @ Jul 9th 2007 4:26PM
A higher percentage than 360 is not necessarily a good thing unless it's close to perfect. Disappointing news to late adopters.
I loves my launch console. Upscales AND dramatically reduces slowdown in PSX and PS2 software.
ChuckSteak0331 @ Jul 9th 2007 4:27PM
Early adapters FTW!
Matt B @ Jul 9th 2007 4:29PM
I'm pretty sure it means that the limited BC is true out of the box. Update to the latest firmware and it should have all the BC that PS3's do now. Isn't the BC all software emulation now anyway? I believe one of the firmware updates actually disabled the EE chip for software emulation.
reakt @ Jul 9th 2007 4:30PM
Big deal! Those of us in Europe have had to put up with this from day one. Actually, it's not even that bad though, as Sony are adding support for more and more PS1 / PS2 titles with every firmware update. I've personally found that all my old games work fine.
cc123 @ Jul 9th 2007 4:29PM
Translation: If you have a large PS2 game collection buy the 60 Gig before they phase it out.
Also the red light on the controller is no mystery. Seybold already said what it was on the blog.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2007/07/08/new-ps3-new-price-drop-more-news-coming/#comment-6679
a.j. @ Jul 9th 2007 4:30PM
shut up already. fanboys attacking other fanboys is so fucking retarded. The PS3 will have limited back. compatibility. OH MAN! SONY SUCKS! Meanwhile the 360 has the same problem. DAMN! go outside and take a walk. EVERYONE.
robert @ Jul 9th 2007 4:37PM
it's raining
Jose @ Jul 9th 2007 4:32PM
Oh, that's bullshit! Shenanigans!
Sony's a bunch of assholes, who also wear asses for hats. I don't know how you would combine that into one all encompassing insult, but I'm sure someone will figure it out, and when they do, it will be an apt description of Sony's games devision.
I want my PS3 to have fucking PS2 hardware, not emulation software that only works on half the games. I was going to buy a PS3 (eventually) only because of backwards compatibility (many more PS2/1 games I want to continue playing, I've long been rid of any Xbox games I used to own). The games are going to be, essentially, the same for both MS's and Sony's consoles (with the exception of Mass Effect: put it in my veins!)
I dread the impending list-o-backwards compatibility which will, undoubtedly leave us wanting more, much like the Xbox360 list. Ugh, I'm just rambling now.
So pissed, so pissed...
Where's my broom?
Lord Chako @ Jul 9th 2007 4:31PM
If the 60 gigs were also switching over to software emulation, that would make the current models somewhat of a collectors item...
Jonah Falcon @ Jul 9th 2007 4:32PM
The reason is that it doesn't have the Emotion chip.
Vidikron @ Jul 9th 2007 4:33PM
FYI, in case some of you missed it, the software emulation actually turned out pretty good. This won't be an issue for most people.
sheppy @ Jul 9th 2007 4:38PM
Good.... but not perfect. Several of the more niche titles are sadly ignored. For example, Bust A Groove 2. It has a timing offset of 5%-10% off the beat. Which is fine for most people.... but it can really screw your performance up on later levels.
James @ Jul 9th 2007 4:43PM
Does anybody have a list of games that are supported on North American (hardware emulation) PS3s, that don't work on European (software emulation) PS3s? I want to know how much I should care -- should I run out and grab a 60 gigger now, while it still has the chip, or am I OK to wait until some good games come out?
JodyAnthony @ Jul 9th 2007 4:34PM
i will get one when they hit $300. I will get a 360 when the elite hits $300 (and has 65nm chips)
until then I will play ball-in-a-cup
Jacob P. @ Jul 9th 2007 4:51PM
until then I will play *latest Wii controls gimmick game*
fixed, amirite?
Do you get it? It's cause you have to move to get the ball in the cup and...you know..sorry...
phail'd
oldest gamer @ Jul 9th 2007 4:38PM
This is totally expected. First software emulation is used in the current 60gb and the future models. Just more of it in the future models. The current 60gb has the RSX chip built in. this is used for display purposes and the CBE emulates the rest. In the current EURO and future models the CBE will emulate it all. Quite a feet. Sony also supports more backwards compatibility titles than m$. But lets be serious, most gamers keep multiple systems hooked up anyway right? These older titles are added through software updates, just like your router, PSP, TiVo cell phone and any other modern device.
Second, the pack in Motor Storm game is one of the best driving / racing single player and online games period. Anyone bitching about 8 on screen multi player online for free with full voice char, friends etc etc? Even DIRT on live is paid for and you can't race others in real time. Hello?
And third, the xbox released only 5 years ago came with an elephant sized controller that wasn't replaced until after it's first year with the controller s.
Software emulation is here to stay on ever console, (even the Wii uses it) and most new devices like the iPhone. It just makes sense to design hardware to utilize this.
Lord Chako @ Jul 9th 2007 4:43PM
"Even DIRT on live is paid for and you can't race others in real time. Hello?"
Whatever.
Jacob P. @ Jul 9th 2007 5:03PM
"Second, the pack in Motor Storm game is one of the best driving / racing single player and online games period. Anyone bitching about 8 on screen multi player online for free with full voice char, friends etc etc? Even DIRT on live is paid for and you can't race others in real time. Hello?"
Now why did you use DiRT as an example? why didn't you use a game like Test Drive: Unlimited? or Forza 2?
Ian @ Jul 9th 2007 5:45PM
Thats because you don't simultaneously race other people in WRC rally racing. You race against a clock.
Rivithed @ Jul 9th 2007 4:37PM
An SCEA rep already confirmed this:
"The current 60 GB model utilizes a hardware and solution for backwards compatibility, namely the Emotion Engine chip. The new 80 GB PS3 will use a software solution for backwards compatibility, similar to that currently found in the PAL model," said Kimberly Otzman, SCEA Corporate Communications Representative.
And on the RED SIXAXIS light: "The controller that comes with the 80GB is the same the controller we shipped at launch, in the packaging the PS button is probably lit up,"
http://www.gamingbits.com/content/view/2292/2/
Qitsyoj @ Jul 9th 2007 4:40PM
How long before the emulators are copied from the HDD and made to work on the PC? or other consoles? :P
cc123 @ Jul 9th 2007 4:39PM
Holy crap...the PS3 just hit #1 on the Amazon Video Games top sellers chart.
http://www.amazon.com/computer-video-games-hardware-accessories/b/ref=gw_br_cvg/002-1575334-6773665?%5Fencoding=UTF8&node=468642&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=left-nav-1&pf_rd_r=1Z76Y4QR3Y219VEB6GDJ&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=285525001&pf_rd_i=507846
Won't last long but it's nice to see. =)
pinsleric @ Jul 9th 2007 4:41PM
so maybe it was a good thing to get one earlier rather than later
Mr Khan @ Jul 9th 2007 4:48PM
The Wii uses software emulation for the VC titles, not GC titles, since the architecture is still the same
its an odd decision, since the EE chip is probably incredibly cheap to produce at this point, and you would REALLY want to have good backwards compatibility when you're coming off of the 110 + million sold console, it should be a bigger priority for Sony than for either MS or Nintendo, but oddly enough Nintendo seems to be the one with the most emphasis on it (with the least significant console to be BC with)
Sidepocket @ Jul 9th 2007 8:14PM
How is the Wii the least backwards compatible? Not only does it have the most titles, but it literally plays everything. Gamecube, N64, SNES, NES, Genisis, Turbo-Graphix and soon Original Games.
WTF are you smoking?
Mr Khan @ Jul 9th 2007 5:38PM
I'm saying that of PS2, Xbox, and GC, it would be least significant to have backwards compatibility with GC, since it sold the least
Sony should focus more, since they sold 5x as many...
Vidikron @ Jul 9th 2007 5:44PM
@Sidepocket
Ummm... he actually said Nintendo has the most emphasis on BC. And VC titles are a bit different than normal BC. That's like claiming the 360 is BC with arcade games because it plays games like Pac-Man. Any of the current systems have the power to play NES, SNES, Genesis, etc... games. My original modded Xbox plays all the VC titles and thousands more.
why not the LS2/LS7? @ Jul 9th 2007 4:53PM
The BC isn't that limited. It's pretty good for SW compatibility. However, if you really want best BC (as I do), you'd better snap up one of the current PS3s before they go.
I have to say though that unlike on the 360, where only 10% of my games worked, on the PS3, I've never played a PS2 game on it that wouldn't have worked on the SW compatibility version*.
The asterisk above is because I play GH2 on my PS2 because it doesn't work on PS3, SW or HW BC. Given that PS2 is seemingly about to drop to $99 and WILL play GH2, I don't have a huge problem with cutting the price of PS3 by $100, given that if you need 100% BC you can then just buy a PS2 also and still come out $1 ahead.
Keep improving that SW BC Sony. If you want to keep PS2 the leading platform in sales, you can't drop the PS2 like MS did with the Xbox.
James:
There is no official list as to what the HW BC PS3 supports that the SW PC PS3 doesn't. Some people have made up some such lists. Be careful when reading them as they often list games with what Sony calls minor defects (which are often just things like slight glitching during cut scenes) as incompatible when they're fairly playable.
Sidepocket @ Jul 9th 2007 8:12PM
The problem here is not the BC per say, it is Sony constantly going back on their word.
Before PS3 came out, they took pride in having a real BC chip set and scoffed the 360's (then) limited software emulated BC. Lots of pot shots were made by Phil over that.
Then shortly after PS3 launches, they do what Microsoft did and act like it is nothing and that software BC is the way to go.
Much like how they said the Killzone 2 trailer was real time and then had to eat their words.
*shakes head*
Spartacus @ Jul 9th 2007 5:06PM
All I have to say is that both MS and Sony are making buying a gaming connsole much more complicated and difficult than it should be. Hopefully this gen turns into a dismal failure for both so they learn and go back to simplicity on the PS4 and Xbox 3. While I have absolutely no intention to ever buy a Wii, I do appreciate Nintendo's philosphy for what it's worth...
Dan @ Jul 9th 2007 5:08PM
Is there really anyone out there buying a PS3 who doesn't already own a PS2?
samfish @ Jul 9th 2007 5:16PM
That doesn't matter. I'd rather have a PS3 that can also play all my PS2 games, rather than have to keep yet another console in my entertainment center.
Jonathan Tran @ Jul 9th 2007 5:17PM
@Dan
Maybe but they might just sell or trade in their PS2s towards the purchase of a PS3, assured they could still play their old games.
I didn't have a GC but if I did I would have sold it and used the money towards a Wii.
This guy woulda also:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyXUVd2c83c
Chainblast @ Jul 9th 2007 5:20PM
I think we can all guess that next North America PS3 hardware announcement will be the discontinuation of the current 60GB SKU. After that the 80GB package will loose Motorstorm and drop its price to $499.
Basically if you want your PS3 to play most of your PS1/PS2 games you need to think about buying a unit soon.
Jose @ Jul 9th 2007 5:27PM
Dan, and anyone else who said anything about already owning a PS2
Yes, I own a fucking PS2, but I could get $60 for the thing (which amounts to a 10% discount). Also, I already have a DVD/VCR player, NGC, and HDTV Tuner hooked up to my TV, I have one HDMI input, and it's already occupied. Why the fuck would I want to leave a PS2 hooked up to a component video port which I could use for a PS3 that will play all my PS2 games. If I were to find one game that I love to be incompatible, I would see it as a waste of $600.
Sony realized they don't have to bring their A game, they just have to bring a little better game than MS, they're not even trying anymore.
Vidikron @ Jul 9th 2007 5:32PM
So if you had a single PS1 or PS2 game you like that didn't work you would consider your $600 a waste? Using that logic, you should just stick with a PS2. Then you will have nearly 100% compatibility with all PS1 and PS2 games. Clearly you aren't interested in PS3 games since limited BC ruins the PS3 purchase.
BNinjaC @ Jul 9th 2007 5:37PM
I've a Euro PS3 and a Huge collection of PS1/PS2 that I've built up over the years. I was pissed off when I found out it would have software emulation but I ponied up the cash anyway.
The only games I have that don't run are Onimusha 1&2 and this well be fixed in a future update.
It's a far better experience than the Xbox emulation on 360. I mean, so few games run and for a lot of people, some of the games that do run, randomly crash. It's really annoying! (I'm speaking first hand here folks).
Software BC on PS3 is very good.
Children of the Americas, have no fear!
BulletToothTony @ Jul 9th 2007 5:43PM
hey guys..
FOR ALL PS3 OWNERS.. GO AND CHECK YOUR BOX.. IT SAYS THE EXACT SAME THING...
you can even go to the ps3 official page and it will say the same thing about the 60gb
http://www.us.playstation.com/PS3/About
look all the way at the bottom
Jose @ Jul 9th 2007 5:57PM
Vid
The purchase of a brand new console merits the weighing of many different factors. Looking at the PS3, and 360, the games look the same, almost all the games are going to be on the other. Exclusives are always a trade off: if I want to play Mass Effect, I won't get to play White Knight; if I want to play White Knight, I don't get to play Mass Effect.
One of the definite advantage the PS3 had was it's 100% backward compatibility, which it no longer has. That's one less bullet point, and one less reason to buy the PS3.
I was lying in bed last night, thinking about the (very distant) future in which I would purchase a new-gen console, and the one reason for which I'd purchase a PS3 instead of a 360 was that assurance that I would be able to play all my fucking games.
Vidikron @ Jul 10th 2007 12:41AM
OK, so if you choose to buy the 360 how is it going to play all your games? It won't. Which means you will have to keep your PS2. So let's examine the other direction... let's say you buy the PS3 and you have a game it won't play. Well, so far you're ahead of the 360 situation, but you may still need to keep your PS2. I fail to see how even limited BC is a somehow worse than going for the 360 if you're truly interested in playing your PS2 games. There's a good chance the PS3 will play all of your PS2 games... at the very least it will play most. The 360 will play none. What am I missing here?
ill trooper @ Jul 10th 2007 7:35AM
Jose, relax. The PS3 using software emulation covers a lot of old games.
Don't lose sleep over this. I gotta tell you: as you're quite honest in saying you aren't buying a 360 or a PS3 until the "distant future," your opinion on this is difficult to take seriously. Your point is valid, but frankly, it's not that big of a deal - the lower price will have far more impact than the lack of the emulation hardware. I'm not usually the "Keep your PS2 around" type of guy, but YOU may want to keep your PS2 easily accessable when you eventually go out and buy a 360 or a PS3.
Griffin @ Jul 9th 2007 6:04PM
I like how Joystiq take any dig they can.
As a EU PS3 owner, I can say, the PS2 software BC is VERY good, marginally inferior to hardware BC, sure, but getting better quickly. I would expect new firmware to address the last 100 or so major missing titles, before the US launch. If anything the lack of EE, makes the unit run cooler, amd more efficient mobo layout.